Cargill Rumor

[Detector]

Really come on people the Casino is not going to generate that amount of money to dent what the Plants bring to the table. Without the plants Dodge City would fade away.

I think you're greatly over exaggerating the amount of money generated by the plants that stays in Dodge City. 30 years ago this would have been true, but today the majority of the workers, being immigrants, send their money back to their homeland. They also mainly do business with immigrant business owners who send their money back to their homeland.

Why do you think Mexico is so pissed about the US cracking down on illegal immigration? It is hurting the amount of American money being sent to Mexico.

I think you're under estimating the impact a casino will have on Dodge City. We are finally seeing a nationwide crack down on illegal immigrants. All one need do is look at the national news every day to see its happening. Those cities, like dodge, that has rolled out the welcome mat to illegal immigration WILL pay the price. A lot of local businesses will suffer as well as the housing market but to that I say greed was your first mistake.

All cities have social problems but Dodge City, thanks to our sanctuary city stance toward immigrants, has major social issues. Our schools are pumping out low grade education because thats what our plants demand. We have a vast amount of people that can't speak a lick of English, because thats what our plants, and now local business except. We have lowered our social standards, because we've had to. A casino will change all that.

[Gunner75]

Made in the USA. You need to pull your head out. Face what is fact.

If it wasn't for the packing plants, this would be a ghost town compared to what it is now.

Lets say tomarrow you could flip a switch. No Hispanics, no plants. GONE.
By Friday, 1/3 of the small business in DC would be thinking about it real hard. That is, what are we going to do.

It goes on an on. You can have the Dodge City that was here before the plants were. "we were doing fine" Without what you have now, the biggest thing here is ag. Look at what it is doing. There are businesses here that have more than 30 employees, a dozen or so.

Cut your fast food joints in 1/2. Cut Bogners profit of beer sales in 1/2 or more. Taxes would suck. Take the business away, take the people away, do you think those who have been making desisions lately are going to cut back. NO, they would eventually have to do so, but they are not going to want to do that.

Folks this is huge. Once a town has a business as such in place and it removed, many thing suffer. As mentioned before, it trickles down.

I would hate to think what would happen if you just removed the workers.

I like it here, I don't like everything about it that is for sure. Dodge City is a small town in my world. I have worked with towns 3 times this size, and the impact of taking something away, or trying to replace workers in this enviorment is never a good thing. It has a huge impact on everything. It just keeps rolling down hill.

On another note. Install the Ethonal plant here. What impact does that have with the plants in place and nothing changed about Dodge. It is simple. The Ethonal plant will further starve our water situation. The packing plants use, per head, per day, in each plant, 1500 gallons per head to process that beef. That is a lot of water being used already.
Install a water starving Ethonal plant, and we have a water problem the following summer. Can't water our grass, because we are trying to make Ethonal. There is no benifit to Ethonal as it stands right now. It will take taxpayers $.55 per gallon to produce it, let alone the 3 gallons of water per gallon of usable Ethonal. It doesn't create many jobs. It takes about 6 people, give or take a couple to run it. The rest are truck drivers, and at the estimated 40 drivers, not many of them will live in Dodge. The Ethonal situation needs to evolve more before it is profitable, resorce managable, overall a replacement for foreign oils.

The casino stands to have a huge impact on the area. I have not researched this at this point, but I have some actual fact numbers from the Topeka area casino's before and after. It will take some time to pull them, and break it down.

[Detector]

Lets say tomarrow you could flip a switch. No Hispanics, no plants. GONE.

You mean like Garden City? When the packing plant in garden burned down it gave them the chance to get out from under the plants thumb.

Again I say look around the nation and see sanctuary cites are being punished.

I used to think Liberals have got to be the stupidest people alive with organizing those protest marches for illegals. I still think the same about Liberals, but I'm now beginning to think those protests were not the results of really really stupid Liberals, but the results of some brilliant anti-illegals.

For a long time some people have been trying to get Americas attention to the rapid yet silent take over of America. Most Americans had a ah its no big deal until we started seeing these arrogant criminals waving the Mexican flag and demanding American rights. This united Americans in a common goal. America has its problems but when Americans unite, you better look out.

Dodge City has put all its eggs in one basket by catering to immigrants both legal and illegal. That basket is about to be crushed and we can either prepare or be devastated.

I've already noticed a change in some local business. Six months ago it was hard to communicate at the vast majority of our fast food places. I'm noticing now even McDonald's has good English speaking employees. And *choke* I'm seeing non-Hispanics at the counters once again.

Things are already in motion and I'm liking the direction.

Lets face it politicians are always the last to get it, but now we are seeing some with the balls to step up and say "I'm for taking America back."

[Army_of_One]

Originally Posted by Gunner75

Made in the USA. You need to pull your head out. Face what is fact.

If it wasn't for the packing plants, this would be a ghost town compared to what it is now.

Lets say tomarrow you could flip a switch. No Hispanics, no plants. GONE.
By Friday, 1/3 of the small business in DC would be thinking about it real hard. That is, what are we going to do.

It goes on an on. You can have the Dodge City that was here before the plants were. "we were doing fine" Without what you have now, the biggest thing here is ag. Look at what it is doing. There are businesses here that have more than 30 employees, a dozen or so.

Cut your fast food joints in 1/2. Cut Bogners profit of beer sales in 1/2 or more. Taxes would suck. Take the business away, take the people away, do you think those who have been making desisions lately are going to cut back. NO, they would eventually have to do so, but they are not going to want to do that.

Folks this is huge. Once a town has a business as such in place and it removed, many thing suffer. As mentioned before, it trickles down.

I would hate to think what would happen if you just removed the workers.

I like it here, I don't like everything about it that is for sure. Dodge City is a small town in my world. I have worked with towns 3 times this size, and the impact of taking something away, or trying to replace workers in this enviorment is never a good thing. It has a huge impact on everything. It just keeps rolling down hill.

On another note. Install the Ethonal plant here. What impact does that have with the plants in place and nothing changed about Dodge. It is simple. The Ethonal plant will further starve our water situation. The packing plants use, per head, per day, in each plant, 1500 gallons per head to process that beef. That is a lot of water being used already.
Install a water starving Ethonal plant, and we have a water problem the following summer. Can't water our grass, because we are trying to make Ethonal. There is no benifit to Ethonal as it stands right now. It will take taxpayers $.55 per gallon to produce it, let alone the 3 gallons of water per gallon of usable Ethonal. It doesn't create many jobs. It takes about 6 people, give or take a couple to run it. The rest are truck drivers, and at the estimated 40 drivers, not many of them will live in Dodge. The Ethonal situation needs to evolve more before it is profitable, resorce managable, overall a replacement for foreign oils.

The casino stands to have a huge impact on the area. I have not researched this at this point, but I have some actual fact numbers from the Topeka area casino's before and after. It will take some time to pull them, and break it down.

The immediate impact would suck but while a few hispanic business's may shut and Bogner may make a few less dollars in the LONG run..(have some vision here) our school districts would save money (MANY MANY less para's hired), the education system in Dodge may get better, some of the area's where the pink houses may not sell now but will eventually sell when the Casino comes to town. Our law enforcement may get a small break not chasing down all of the crime that comes with the illegals in this town. Eventually out taxes SHOULD go down because we are not paying for so many social ills. YES we are a society and will always have social problems but not to the degree that we have now. The immediate impact of a packing plant closing would be negative but the long term would be good. Just like when they moved here...immediate impact was bringing in a few extra dollars and such but in time it ran the city into what it is now...a border town. Also if the city wasn't inundated with high crime and filthy MAYBE more people would be attracted here. What attracts people now. A NON hispanic family of four has NO reason to move here unless they get SENT here to work. Would YOU move your family here and send your kids to this horrid school district where 25% of the kids at the High School can't even speak English? Not me pal. You can't attract quality if you have crap. Dodge City stood on it's own before and could probably do it again.

[Made in the USA]

Originally Posted by Gunner75

Made in the USA. You need to pull your head out. Face what is fact.

If it wasn't for the packing plants, this would be a ghost town compared to what it is now.

Lets say tomarrow you could flip a switch. No Hispanics, no plants. GONE.
By Friday, 1/3 of the small business in DC would be thinking about it real hard. That is, what are we going to do.

It goes on an on. You can have the Dodge City that was here before the plants were. "we were doing fine" Without what you have now, the biggest thing here is ag. Look at what it is doing. There are businesses here that have more than 30 employees, a dozen or so.

Cut your fast food joints in 1/2. Cut Bogners profit of beer sales in 1/2 or more. Taxes would suck. Take the business away, take the people away, do you think those who have been making desisions lately are going to cut back. NO, they would eventually have to do so, but they are not going to want to do that.

Folks this is huge. Once a town has a business as such in place and it removed, many thing suffer. As mentioned before, it trickles down.

I would hate to think what would happen if you just removed the workers.

I like it here, I don't like everything about it that is for sure. Dodge City is a small town in my world. I have worked with towns 3 times this size, and the impact of taking something away, or trying to replace workers in this enviorment is never a good thing. It has a huge impact on everything. It just keeps rolling down hill.

On another note. Install the Ethonal plant here. What impact does that have with the plants in place and nothing changed about Dodge. It is simple. The Ethonal plant will further starve our water situation. The packing plants use, per head, per day, in each plant, 1500 gallons per head to process that beef. That is a lot of water being used already.
Install a water starving Ethonal plant, and we have a water problem the following summer. Can't water our grass, because we are trying to make Ethonal. There is no benifit to Ethonal as it stands right now. It will take taxpayers $.55 per gallon to produce it, let alone the 3 gallons of water per gallon of usable Ethonal. It doesn't create many jobs. It takes about 6 people, give or take a couple to run it. The rest are truck drivers, and at the estimated 40 drivers, not many of them will live in Dodge. The Ethonal situation needs to evolve more before it is profitable, resorce managable, overall a replacement for foreign oils.

The casino stands to have a huge impact on the area. I have not researched this at this point, but I have some actual fact numbers from the Topeka area casino's before and after. It will take some time to pull them, and break it down.

"Pull my head out"??? I have been a citizen of Dodge City for over 40 years. I know all of the ins and outs of this town. All the politics, the things that happen that never get mentioned or published, the economy, the local business owners, the crimes, you name it!

As for the "small businesses", most of them have been driven out of town by the so called "economic development". How many people have been busted because of the "Wall-of-China-Mart"? How many have severely suffered because your packing plants don't do their business locally, but rather buy from suppliers from out of town?

Seems like we could cut our fast food joints in half, as we have too many anyway. We used to have some good restaurants, where you could get good food, and the servants could understand what you wanted because they could speak ENGLISH!

Taxes would actually be lower, as we would not need all of the infrastructure to support all of the influx of illegals. Our drivers would have licenses and insurance. Our County Health Department would not be the "free clinic" for illegals. Our Welfare offices would not be supporting illegals, that have jobs and drive big new vehicles. Our medical services and hospital would actually get paid for services rendered. We would not be building a new school every year. We would have teachers that liked their jobs and salaries. We would not have to bus kids all over town to schools. Our environmental problems would be less expensive. Our wastewater plant would not be overloaded with grease, blood, and high BOD/COD. We would not have an illegal company, ie Chamness, dumping CRAP into our environment without even having permission or a permit to do it. We could actually walk the streets and feel safe. We wouldn't be having to paint over graffiti all the time. Our police force would not be overburdened. The gang and drug problems would be either non-existent or at least a more minor problem.

The packing plants use 1500 gallons of water per head, as you stated. Hell, that is more than an ethanol plant would utilize. The ethanol boom is about to go into the 'crapper' anyway. You cannot produce ethanol without using more energy than is gained from the ethanol. Plus, you have increased pricing of grain, which in turn affects cattle feeders, and consumers in general. Also, freight costs stack up in bringing in grain, and hauling spent mash out. Ethanol supplies lower energy content to the fuel than oil, thus you are spending more money to get less energy from the fuel. Doesn't make sense without the government subsidies.

The casino should bring in some economic development. However, I think it would do better, in a better "environment". Do you want to go to a destination casino where the air smells, the town is dirty, and you could get mugged just going to your motel?? I can think of better places to go. Of course, if you just "flip that switch", things would get better immediately!

[Highwayman]

Originally Posted by Made in the USA

....Ethanol supplies lower energy content to the fuel than oil, thus you are spending more money to get less energy from the fuel. Doesn't make sense without the government subsidies....

MIT, that doesn’t make sense with the government subsides.

[Gunner75]

There are many good points made. I cannot argue that.

Take away the packing plants. Lets say you could do this overnight. Please list the items that DC would offer to draw in new people.

This area w/o the packing plants is mostly ag related. And that is pretty much all set up.

Also, list the items that would turn off new families to the area.

I don't think the casino is a bad thing, but there are some not so nice things about areas that have casino's.

One thing I can tell you. I know of several places around town that have had great offers to move away from Dodge. Some so great that the buildings needed to operate there business were to be built and givin to them at no charge, tax breaks, etc, etc, etc.

There are many towns/areas that want the industry. Packing plants don't make sence there due to locations.

Just tossing out some other items to think about.

[Highwayman]

Originally Posted by Gunner75

...Take away the packing plants. Lets say you could do this overnight. Please list the items that DC would offer to draw in new people....

An English speaking community with lots of very affordable housing.

[midgetlover]

Well here is a fact for you to think about.

When Monfort burned down it didnt burn down the whole place just a portion of it which they repaired and REOPENED without anyone knowing much about it as a PORK slaughterhouse. Which didnt work out to well being that this is beef country hence the BEEF packing houses.

Tyson bought out IBP and and with that being the largest beef packing plant in the nation they, Tyson, upped their workforce and lowered their hours of work by hiring alot of the "missplaced" Monfort employees So Garden City never had a shot a getting out from "under" the beef packing stigma or what ever you would like ot call it.

The reason the "New Monfort" didnt work is because Seaboard, right outside Liberal is the pork plant around here.

Who cares about the money being sent back to Mexico. What you all fail to realize is that no matter what name they use no matter where they they still live here, pay rent here, buy food here (thanks wal-mart), gas, clothes so and so on. GEt over that the money is still being spent here, taxes are still being paid, renters are still collecting their rent, the quick marts are still getting their gas paid for and here is the kicker TAXES ARE STILL BEING PAID on those wages. The business they spend their money at still get paid and they pay taxes. Its a never ending circle.

This is ag country and with the gov. Having to bail out the farmers almost every year we have not and never will be able to survive as just a plain ag based area WITHOUT the plants.

The water used at the plants for the cattle is recirculated water that is run thru their own filtration system, that is what that round tank is that youo could see while driving past National Beef that had the KSU logo on it, well that was part of the water that they used. Cargill uses the same system both call it Waste Water and they are placed in DAF tanks to skimm the excess off and sent back thru the system to reuse. Cargill has a much larger system than National.

National get a huge tax break from the city because every other week they have to "PIG" the sewer lines running from National beef to the south dodge smalll waste water. (its off trail the only way i know how to get there is turn off underpass west on trail and then turn left down the next road its at the the end off the dead end road to your right real small.)

Affordable housing would still be around if property taxes werent raised every damn year. They wouldnt have to raise rent if taxes werent raised all the time prompting property owners to raise the rent to compensate the loss. The illegals do not help it but they arent the only reason rent sucks in Dodge now.

Dodge City has relied on on these plants for over 25yrs to help bring money into this town. If they just up and left Dodge City would collapse. They would never bring the Casino here if it wasnt for the Plants (largest employers in sw kansas).

The plants dont always buy supplies from out of town. Gears from Curtis, motors and parts from IBT (who is making a killing from both places), Young Electric is there OUTSIDE electrical contractors for them. National Beef also using an outside electrical contractor for larger jobs also which is also a local contractor (National Beefs contractor has a home office in california but they are open in this town). They both rely on outside refrigeration contractors when needed which are local businesses. They use local trucking companies to haul cattle to the plant. I can keep going if you wish...................

They didnt build the plants here to buy outside the local economical base. They utilize what is around them to help the city also.

National Beef has been in talks to buy Curtis and it keeps falling thru do to the fact that Curtis thinks they are worth than they really are. They were going to start C&C operators $14 to start and they were going to keep Curtis open and it up as their own gear box and parts supplier. The ultimate plan was for them to employ with in the city and keep Curtis here and not have to buy outside the city when we could keep it here and supply themselves and Liberals plant AND other plants around. It was to be a skilled only position to work at Curtis if they had bought it and they planned on keeping the the same employees already there.

You cant use the plants not buying into the economy. It isnt true.

Why dont you show your disapproval of the plants here buy not attending anything that Dodge City Days puts on. Cargill and National are the biggest sponsors for it. They do have bbq's in the park. Dont stop at there booths. Better yet dont eat the meat that will show them. Stop shopping in Dodge, drive to Garden adn Wichita for your household needs.

We need the plants to survive.

[midgetlover]

Here is one more thiing about the Casino, crime rate will go up, divorce rate will go up, poverty and bankruptcy will go up. They will never divulge those type of stats to the public. Casinos are money pits and wil only worsen Dodge. You might as well figure how much money you plan on spending there every week. Multiply that by 52. Prepare to mortgage you home AGAIN from the bank. Most homeowners will now have raise their rent (hey thats novel idea) to have EXTRA spending money at the casino..............so on and so on.

Casino is a bad bad bad idea for Dodge and you are fools to think other wise.